The man who brought you Character Counts in an effort to spread proper discourse across our land says civility has sunk to the lowest level he’s seen in his 75 years, and it’s still falling.

“We have never had more uncivil discourse,” Michael Josephson, a consultant on civility, said during a Des Moines visit. “I’m 75 years old, and there has never been anything even close. There’s been an occasional instance of this or that.

“We can’t count on truth today, and that is a message that is going to our youth. People have to stand up to that regardless of their party.

“I believe we need to have a character prerequisite for anyone who is going to lead your companies,” Josephson said. “If someone in those positions did or said some of the same things we are seeing in Washington, they would be fired.”

Josephson is a national expert on ethics and runs his own center in Los Angeles, taking no salary. He helps companies as large as Kroger and Johnson & Johnson. He has had a big hand in the 8 million children nationally (50,000 in Iowa) who have participated in Character Counts, which teaches the six pillars of character: trustworthiness, respect, responsibility, fairness, caring and citizenship.

Scott Raecker, who runs the Robert D. and Billie Ray Center at Drake University, who was sitting in on my interview, tried to interject that civility has been worse. He mentioned as an example Vice President Aaron Burr’s shooting of former Cabinet member Alexander Hamilton in a duel in which Hamilton shot first but missed.

But Josephson wasn’t budging. 

“I disagree with Scott. I think it is worse,” Josephson said. “As an ongoing steady stream of how we have changed the norm. We have changed the norm.” As evidence, he mentioned President Donald Trump’s campaign calls to “lock up” former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, and his labeling of a sitting member of Congress as “Pocahontas.”

“We wouldn’t allow a middle school teacher to talk like this,” Josephson said.

Just as he was when the talk was about President Bill Clinton’s Oval Office affair with Monica Lewinsky, “I am ashamed at the discourse today,” he added.

I interviewed Josephson on July 24 during his visit to the Robert D. and Billie Ray Center at Drake University. It seemed appropriate just days after Gov. Bob Ray, the very image of Character Counts in Iowa, had passed away. 

When I asked Josephson about the state of civility nationally, he responded immediately: “I think schools are far more sensitive to character development in education than they ever have before. When we first started in the ’90s it was very difficult to get people to teach about values, but I think that value is won.”

More than half of Iowa schools have character programs. “We got beyond the concern over whose values,” Josephson said. “Liberal or conservative? These are values that are apolitical.” 

But social media have changed the environment that students face, and anxiety levels are high, challenging teachers who speak of civility and respect. Bullying is a “huge problem,” Josephson said. 

And our state, for all its “Iowa nice,” isn’t perfect. “I can’t say the problem is solved. Iowa still has a drinking problem. It has a bullying problem,” Josephson said.

In the business world, Volkswagen, Wells Fargo and others have faced controversies that exposed individuals’ poor decisions but also show the need for companies to set the tone for ethical conduct, he added. 

“What you allow, you encourage. Trust is a tower built stone by stone. When you do something distrustful, it’s taking a stone from the bottom” and toppling things.

Overall, he’s confident civility, and ethics, will rise again. 

“It’s going to be a pendulum. In time it will swing back.”